Forum Activity for @outlander

Dusty...thank you for the additional information & comments. I had made plans for a new dulcimer but it didn't work out so it's been a bit of a scramble to find something else.  A performer/music teacher I'll be taking lessons from knew my other dulcimer hadn't worked out and she told me the New Harmony sound was lovely. That seems to correspond with what you explained about the full sound & undercut bridge effect. A rounded guitar sound is exactly what I'd like. I feel like your quote ... keep one foot in the past & one foot forward into the future. I like the innovations Rick Gooden has made & don't mind something new & modern. 

I'll ask Rick when we meet next week whether I'm a candidate for the Accutune module. I'm just an advanced beginner & not sure I'll be able to recognize when finer tuning is needed. By the way, I was watching your Modern Flatpicking video here last night. That's how I want to play. Thanks for taking the time to make the videos.

Anyway, while I know the shade of wood tones I like, I'm very interested in hearing what Rick has to say about wood choices. I noticed they are reconstructing a new website. When I sent him a brief email outlining what I had in mind, I wrote that I like simple elegance so appearance was important to me. Just now, I saw what they put up while working on a rebuilt website & low and behold, they said their dulcimers have a simple elegance. I'm so glad they took it to heart that elegance can, indeed, be simple & doesn't require hundreds of dollars worth of embellishments. The more I hear, the more I am respecting the level of talent Rick has in his ideas. He said he is looking forward to designing my new dulcimer and so am I. Nice folks there in New Harmony but then, I have yet to meet a dulcimer person I didn't like. Great people all.  Thanks for taking the time to give me the information you did ... it really helps me know I'm making the right decision. Wish I could visit New Harmony & get a peek at dulcimers in progress to watch the making process.  So interesting I think.   Barb

Hello Hugs, here's my tab for "A Light At The River" it is a hymn written around 1911, DAA noter and drone. Hope this helps.

There’s a light at the river

There’s a deep, turbid river, Flowing on before, And its waters are deep and wide;

     0       0    3        3   3   5  3      1    3     3    1   0        0    0    3   3     5       7      5      4
But faith sees a light, yes, a beacon bright, Just down by the river side.

 7       3       3   3   5        3    3    1    3       0      6-6      5      5    3    4 4     3

There’s a light at the river, A light at the river; A light at the river I can see;

     0       0   6      6   6    6  8    6   5      5    3   5  5    7   7      7    7   8  7  7  5     4
My Lord will stand and hold in His hand, A light at the river for me.

 7      7       5       5       3    4-3    3   1      3      6    5     5    3   4  4    4    3

O’er the dark, foaming waters, From the unseen shore, Angel bands in their beauty

   0     0      3        3     3      5   3        1      3     3    1       0        0    0     3      3     5       7   5        
glide, And will bear us away to the realms of day, Into light on the other side.    ch

  4         7      7     3     3   3  5    3   3        1       3    0     6  6    5     5    3    4  4      3

Many dear ones we’ve loved Are from their homes removed, Dipped their wings in

   0  0     3      3         3         5       3      1        3         3        1     0            0         0        3      3

the mystic tide; They have passed o’er the deep, Where they’ll ne’er more weep,

 5      7   5     4         7      7          3        3      3      5            3         3         1        3        0
In the light on the other side.     ch

6    6      5     5    3    4  4      3

To this deep, endless river We must one day come, And we’ll cross o’er its waters

  0    0      3        3     3    5  3    1      3       3     1      0          0      0       3       3     5     7   5

wide; How happy we’ll be, if by faith we see The light on the other side.   

   4         7     3    3      3     5   3  3     1      3    0    6-6    5     5    3    4  4     3

There’s a light at the river, A light at the river; A light at the river I can see;

     0       0   6      6   6    6  8    6   5      5    3   5  5    7   7      7    7   8  7  7  5     4
My Lord will stand and hold in His hand, A light at the river for me.

 7      7       5       5       3    4-3    3   1      3      6    5     5    3   4  4    4    3

Barbara, I think you have made a good choice.  You will have to tell me about it once you decide!

Thank you, Joseph!  Great idea...  Why didn't I think of that?  LOL

I know a few people who have bought New Harmony dulcimers over the past year or two.  They rave about the big, full sound.  I haven't played one myself, but hope to soon.  I met Rick (the luthier, not the business/PR guy) in Zoom when New Harmony was a vendor at the virtual Berkeley Dulcimer Gathering.  He seemed to know most of the other dulcimer makers in the country and was familiar with the variations in their designs. I'm not ready to buy another dulcimer right now, but we discussed my personal preferences, and he was certainly willing to build a dulcimer to please me.

Several luthiers offer a three-string option, and a few (like Modern Mountain Dulcimers) only make dulcimers with three strings.  That approach may be in the minority, but it is not unheard of.

As @gail-webber explains, the accutune bridge is a way of adjusting the compensation for each string individually, providing greater accuracy in intonation depending on tuning and string gauge. 

Perhaps just as importantly, the New Harmony design does not really use an end block.  Instead the strings latch onto an undercut bridge with several inches to spare before the end of the top. That design allows the sound board to resonate a lot more than it does on a standard dulcimer. The resulting sound resembles not the traditional, high silvery sound of older dulcimers but the warmer, round sound of a guitar.

As for the hole in the head, I assumed it was simply so that the instrument would be easy to hang on a wall on a simple peg, like those traditional Shaker chairs.

Check out YouTube.

Gail....an update. Just heard from Rick Gooden & we're Zooming next Tuesday to talk about him designing a dulcimer for me. I sent him an email with general thoughts ie VSL, wood tones, tuners, etc. .... he said he could easily design something very nice for me within my price range so I'm thrilled. He's going to be gone the rest of the week to the Gateway Dulcimer Festival. 

And the journey begins....thanks to you.   Barb

I used to have a CD with Margaret Wright singing "A Light at the River" and cannot get her lovely voice out of my head with this tune.  It's haunting me!  😅  I am dying to play it but don't see it in her songbooks.  Anyone familiar with it?  TIA!

By Jove, I believe you're right! And, I was able to find a great number of references to him, his wife Yvonne and their dulcimers. It's too bad there's no trace of a label. I'd love to know what year etc. it was made. It looks like he was featured in Dulcimer Player's News several times and actually wrote a book about playing Irish music on the Mountain Dulcimer.

Hey, Bull Terrier named Gary!  So nice you can foster, @paula!   

Paula, I sent you a private message, but for those who may look at this thread, I think this a North Country Dulcimer made by Robert Hutchinson.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Oh my. What a 'squishable' nose Gary has! 

We're currently fostering this fellow. His name is Gary. Bull Terrier.

Cheers,

Paula

 IMG_1105.jpg - 143KB

I would be interested in something like that. I have used the Seymour Duncan kind with my acoustic guitar before. Would be fine n with dulcimer too. 

I've had this dulcimer for about 30+ years. It was a pawn shop acquisition. I imagine it was most likely homemade but it seems nicely done. I've never seen one exactly like it especially the standing bridge. Any info someone might have would be lovely.

Thanks,

Paula

 948986D4-93E8-41E3-B50E-D0B26E68E4C3_1_201_a.jpg - 58KB

@dusty-turtle interesting!  I ordered a basic FolrkLife set with 11s for my melody strings and not being used to tuning a dulcimer, broke them. So now I have GHS Boomer electric guitar strings in 13 (I think B string on guitar in that set) on the melody strings as I had a bunch of sets laying around I bought in a blowout sale once. 

decided I liked that better anyway, especially trying to tune for Joni’s All I Want. Will look at the middle and bass strings too and see if I want to up the gauge.

Kitty heaven

Lighter strings will be looser.  Heavier strings will be tighter.

If you're playing by yourself, though, and don't need to be in a specific key, I would suggest tuning higher for tighter strings and lower for looser strings.  That's a lot easier than changing strings.

I have a follow up question. I know I’ve heard comments about floppy strings with low/loose tuning. I just can’t remember what the cure is, heavier or lighter gauge strings? Thanks

Our cat Teddy taking a nap in our bed today...

I set a Seymour Duncan up years ago under the strings in a flat space at strum hollow, so I could learn & use the Boss GT-1 during Harvey, the TX  Hurricane.  It is the only dulcimer I had with a flat space, all others had the strum hollow. 

 229938442_4188293084580015_7402355955313553331_n.jpg - 10KB

Hey, @johnpat27.  I have  a few thoughts here.

Consider starting with three strings, especially if you want to fingerpick.  Just remove the doubled strings.  You can always add them back later on.  I was given this advice when I first started and out of nothing but hubris, I resisted it, thinking that since I play 12-string guitar and mandolin the extra strings wouldn't bother me.  But eventually (like 2 years later) I strung up my instrument with three single strings and loved the clarity of the sound.  Some techniques (like hammer-ons and pull-offs) are easier with single strings and some (like bending) are virtually impossible with double strings.

Second, there are two resources for drone players close by: Strumelia's Mountain Dulcimer Noter and Drone Blog (which others have mentioned but not provided a link for) and the Old Style Noter and Drone Players Group here at FOTMD.  You have to join the group to see all the posts, but you'll find lots of information and camaraderie there. 

Third, have fun. Put the the instrument on your lap, find a melody that you like, and let your instrument ring!

Lisa Strumelia has a Noter & Drone Blog, and I wrote a booklet years ago called Get Noterized, both of which are accessible from here at FOTMD.  Many of us who primarily play N&D do play by ear, but we also simply use just the melody line from other dulcimer tabs.  There are other sources for hard-core N&D players as well.  It all depends on the kind of music you're interested in.

BTW the more correct designation for your tuning is DdAdd.  The D and the A are in the same octave, but the d's are an octave higher than D.    The octave setup Dd for a 5 string dulcimer is intended to give an added richness to the sound compared to the older DD couplet.

It is, as you say, Ddadd. 

So far I am pleased with the setup, it has a pleasing sound.

By the way its worth noting that the vast majority of string instruments have intonation issues way up the neck. I'm not sure if this is because of how much a small imprecision can affect the tonality, or if it is simply the nature of string instruments that ideal intonation at the top of the fretboard is not the same as at the bottom.

All I know is that most of the guitars, dulcimers, mandolins, and every other string instrument I've ever looked at close with a tuner tends to be less well intonated further up the fretboard.

Hello John, it is more common to see doubled bass strings, but having a thin string there is perfectly fine. It is most likely intended to be tuned an octave up from the bass note, which is the same as the melody note in a 1-5-8 tuning(if you were tuning D a dd, this would be Dd a dd), but if you are playing in a 1-5-5 tuning then perhaps this is different and someone else might know if that is still correct.

I can't recommend any sites specifically for noter playing, however I have found many tabs on dulcimertab.com and everythingdulcimer.com which are suitable for noter style. Really most of the tabs I see for 1-5-5 tunings such as DAA are well suited to noter drone.

Also, if you can read sheet music or are willing to learn, I have noticed that the majority of popular vocal melodies of the last hundred years are diatonic and can be transcribed to dulcimer and are readily available online. This is a fun way to bring contemporary songs into your noter drone playing.

-Nate

Thanks for all the advice! 

I ended up buying one of Bill Bergs 5-string instruments. Only slightly more than I was looking to spend, but it came with a nice case, a noter, picks, Korg tuner. Happy so far! Only questions I have so far:

1)I can't find many examples of five string setups online, and the ones that do reference two bass strings, but mine came with the same size string as the melody strings next to the bass string. Normal?

2) I also can't find many resources for pure noter playing. Everything seems to be chords, which I am loving, but I still want to try noter playing. Is all noter playing pretty much by ear?

As it's set now, I am more concerned on having clear notes as I fret - it is not so high to be uncomfortable. I may sand it a bit more, I was just giving myself time to decide. Also in changing the strings I put on heavier ones (& a different brand) deciding now if I wanted to go a bit lighter on the melody. 

Thanks for all your help,  the Intonation  was the concern at first but it is right on now. 

Glad to hear its going well! Clearly you are aware of the nickel and dime technique for setting action, and as others have said having the action a bit high is perfectly fine but may be less comfortable, and too low of action can produce buzzing. Typically  setting the action with a nickel will not be low enough to produce buzzing unless either the fingerboard is uneven or some frets are raised. If you have a straight edge which you can use to verify that the fretboard is perfectly consistent, as it should be, then you should feel safe reducing the bridge enough that the string just barely touches the top of a nickel sitting on top of the 7th fret. If it is comfortable to play and well intonated then this is not really necessary, although I will say that I personally really like the action as low as I can get it.
-Nate

(Now that you have conquered set-up, the next thing is you will start building dulcimers.)

  I feel good about learning to care for a dulcimer but - not there yet on building. Would love to watch someone from start to finish but I'm better at drawing one then building one.

Morning

Marg, I'm glad to hear that it went well for you. A little high isn't too bad if it doesn't hurt your fingers. You can always sand it down a little more later if you need to. The biggest danger is string buzzing if you go too low. Then you would either have to make a new nut or shim the old one. Now that you have conquered set-up, the next thing is you will start building dulcimers.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

OK, careful, careful.

Sanded down - still space between nickel & string but much easier to fret, so will leave it here for now.

What would have taken someone maybe an hour or two to set up, has taken me 3 days but I learned a lot and took my time - checking with you guys as I went.

Team effort - Thanks again

Yes, of course you can sand the bridge. Be careful, though, and go little by little. When you were working on the nut you really couldn't mess up since the zero fret was going to set the height of the strings down on that end of the dulcimer. You don't have that safety net when you work on the bridge.

Thanks Dusty, I was so busy working up at the nut - just wanted to make sure I could still sand the bridge.

Sorry, nut is sanded down, strings are on the 0 fret, it's the bridge (bottom end) I'm considering sanding.

So, I can sand the bridge to help  the action. I really think the dulcimer was set up for a noter

Marg, if the strings are really sitting on the zero fret so that the strings are vibrating between the zero fret and the bridge, the nut will have no effect on the action.  You might consider sanding down the bridge, however.  

One last question, I hope:

Nut sanded, new strings & tone is good  off the 0 fret -

But the action is still a bit too high - can I sand the bridge down just a bit?

Thanks again Gail. I'm still in the process of shopping for a new dulcimer & am looking into all I can. Your info helps so much with the New Harmony instruments. I have a well made, very pretty Ron Gibson Barbara Allen style baritone that I've dragged everywhere & enjoyed for almost 5 years but now these old hands need something easier to play & a 25" VSL. I'll never sell my Gibson but probably won't play it as much as I did before.  I'm looking forward to driving down to New Harmony for the Dulcimer Chatauqua on the Wabash in October too. 

As far as just 3 strings - I always remove one when I've had dulcimers with the double melody string.  I do a combination of strumming and cross picking and find it much easier without the double melody string.  I think people who play noter/drone style like the double strings more because of the sound.

Two of mine have the accutune feature - instead of just a movable bridge you have 3 different places to fine tune the strings on the bridge.  It's supposed to help fine tune the upper notes.  Honestly, I haven't really used the feature a lot.  Once I get the strings in tune they seem to be pretty accurate up the fretboard.  They do make custom instruments.  All 3 of mine are custom made with exactly what I wanted and they were very nice to work with.